Lpp Pricing Concern.....you Want What??

[the horn13]

Originally Posted by davekr

I figured we would have heard from LPP......

RLMFAO

[LPP Rep]

OK... hold on here guys...

First off, I did not respond earlier for two reasons. One, we don't spend all day on this or any other forum. We do have a business to run you know.

Second, we needed to chat with Laser Protector USA to find out if they knew what the heck Dave was talking about (which they did not). Now reading Horn's comments, this makes sense and his clarification is much appreciated.

I'll comment more on this in another post in just a moment... after this one....

Originally Posted by mrcllusb

Ya know Dave i'm with you..Frigg that.I think the problem is that here and RD.Net,these businesses know that alot of us are enthusiast and are feeding off of that to come up with these crazy outrageous prices figuring hey these folks wanna be able to not get tagged period so lets overprice our product and see who bites.I mean really how much does it really cost to produce a product like this.The startup cost may be the only costly thing.After that it's cake.They aren't filing for any special fcc id or anything like that.Just patents.As long as folks want this stupid JTG scenario then these units will always be ridiculously priced.

Mrcllusb, have you ever started a business from scratch? Do you know WHY people start a business? Many reasons, but chief amongst them are usually financial independence and personal (time bound) independence.

Would you expect to work for a company and not get paid for your time? I don't think it's reasonable to expect someone to invent or create something and not make any money at it. For that, we would not have these products at all.

Second, start-up costs these days are often quite high - especially for specialized industries like this one. And patents... they are much more expensive than you realize.

I do agree with your comment about people's expectations for JTG performance. That is an unrealistic expectation, because it leads to people thinking they are invulnerable, which leads to unwanted roadside conversations.

However, there is definitely a difference with regard to performance of the various products on the marketplace.

And third, allow me to give you a brief history lesson on laser diode based laser defense products. The first laser diode based system in the U.S. was the Lidatek LE-10, which was developed in the late 1990's - well before the advent of RD.net and the current "enthusiast" craze. The LE-10 was a Class 3b laser product, which is the main reason it didn't stick around.

Originally Posted by mrcllusb

I'll stick with my nice LED based system and call it good.There is no reason for JTG performance if people would just drive more respectable.You watch,if leos' continue to run into problems of not being able to acquire a reading from vehicles,soon you'll start to see me obstruction tickets,vehicle inspections wondering why they couldn't get a reading,and the biggest one of them all,new laser defense laws.

That is already happening. Laser jammers are illegal in 8 states. One reason why you're better off with a parking sensor.

Originally Posted by mrcllusb

Forget these ridiculous prices i'll keep my money in my pocket.I know Belscort isn't high on everyones list,but atleast you get a full system for your money.

Which is more ridiculous?

The price of good protection vs. Fines + Points on your license + higher insurance costs + extra fines in some states (e.g. NJ, TX, VA)???

And full system from Belscort? For $1,500 you can get a full system (SRX), which gives poorer performance than - for example, a dual head LPP + a V1 ($1300 MSRP) or STi ($1350 MSRP) - and the SRX setup will cost you more to boot. How is that keeping money in your pocket to go the Belscort route?

And btw, if you think the laser diode companies are raking it in, you should do some research on what it costs to purchase a laser diode (especially a high powered one) versus the cost of a similar wavelength IR diode. HUGE cost difference.

[LPP Rep]

Originally Posted by davekr

Well first I owned and AL7, I know it's not "the same" sure looks it. The heads were not very well made. Hell they were all scracted up after install. And my installer routinely does $10,000 systems.

The system broke before it even got tested. Did anyone offer me assistance? No

Dave,

Please, please understand that the AL7 and LPP are made by different companies (which are not related) and have completely different internals.

They may be similar in appearance (at least in terms of the laser heads), but the similarity ends there. I even doubt that they are as similar as you might think in that regard.

Are all watches the same? Is a Tag Heuer the same as a Timex? They both look like watches, right?? Please don't discredit another company's brand based on your negative experience with a competitor. That is irrational and unfair.

[LPP Rep]

Originally Posted by the horn13

Not totally true Dave.

1) I had no communication with USA LPP rep

Glad to hear as this confirms what we heard as well.

Originally Posted by the horn13

5) The Canadian Distributor stepped up to the plate and provided me a new control box with the 100 pps fix.
6) The rep in Canada is a straight up honest guy.

That's good to hear also. If there is anything we can do to facilitate helping with such an issue in the future (in terms of any U.S. customers), please PM us.

I am curious though. What exactly was the problem you ran into with the Junction Box? That is the first time that I've ever heard of a JB problem.

[Stealthcb]

How much did you pay for the LPP new? I am looking at upgrading to a much faster car soon, and would like a jammer as protection.

[mrcllusb]

Originally Posted by LPP Rep

OK... hold on here guys...

First off, I did not respond earlier for two reasons. One, we don't spend all day on this or any other forum. We do have a business to run you know.

Second, we needed to chat with Laser Protector USA to find out if they knew what the heck Dave was talking about (which they did not). Now reading Horn's comments, this makes sense and his clarification is much appreciated.

I'll comment more on this in another post in just a moment... after this one....




Mrcllusb, have you ever started a business from scratch? Do you know WHY people start a business? Many reasons, but chief amongst them are usually financial independence and personal (time bound) independence.

Would you expect to work for a company and not get paid for your time? I don't think it's reasonable to expect someone to invent or create something and not make any money at it. For that, we would not have these products at all.

Second, start-up costs these days are often quite high - especially for specialized industries like this one. And patents... they are much more expensive than you realize.

I do agree with your comment about people's expectations for JTG performance. That is an unrealistic expectation, because it leads to people thinking they are invulnerable, which leads to unwanted roadside conversations.

However, there is definitely a difference with regard to performance of the various products on the marketplace.

And third, allow me to give you a brief history lesson on laser diode based laser defense products. The first laser diode based system in the U.S. was the Lidatek LE-10, which was developed in the late 1990's - well before the advent of RD.net and the current "enthusiast" craze. The LE-10 was a Class 3b laser product, which is the main reason it didn't stick around.




That is already happening. Laser jammers are illegal in 8 states. One reason why you're better off with a parking sensor.




Which is more ridiculous?

The price of good protection vs. Fines + Points on your license + higher insurance costs + extra fines in some states (e.g. NJ, TX, VA)???

And full system from Belscort? For $1,500 you can get a full system (SRX), which gives poorer performance than - for example, a dual head LPP + a V1 ($1300 MSRP) or STi ($1350 MSRP) - and the SRX setup will cost you more to boot. How is that keeping money in your pocket to go the Belscort route?

And btw, if you think the laser diode companies are raking it in, you should do some research on what it costs to purchase a laser diode (especially a high powered one) versus the cost of a similar wavelength IR diode. HUGE cost difference.

Actually,yes i have tried starting my own business,and yes i do understand startup cost for instance.You want an alarm/remote start unit installed in your vehicle.Now the unit cost me maybe 150.00 but i'm charging you 400.00 installed.Now with that being said,heat shrink is 2.00 a pack and with a pack i can do friggin 20 cars.The system 150.00 an hour of my time 65.00 now lets add that up 217.00 so i made a profit of almost 200.00 on each unit.Not to include the markup up on any accessories.I've been in the automotive accessories field so i know about bottom line cost and overhead.Now with that being said can you honestly tell your customers how much your making off of each unit sold? To bring up another point that you made.Your LPP cost compared to fines and such.Guess what, if we drove like we had common sense,then those fines and insurance going up wouldn't be a factor.But since your style business is drivin by the consumers that wanna be like i said before damn near invisible,then yes that is a selling point for you.

[davekr]

LPP rep, thanks for your time. I repsect what you wrote. I still think you repsons profesionally. I guess there are still my thoughts.

1) True, it is unfair of me to compare your LPP to the AL7. But I hope you can understand the frustration that came with my AL7. When it did break, my installer said he couldn't get the fuse here in the states.

2) I look at the v1 which I paid $399 for. It is a top RD no quesiotions asked. Why do I have to pay double for an LPP? I know it's comparing apples to oranges in a way but still....the technology is there and great construction.

3) I would love to own your LPP. I can't afford that. Simply put. I am not trying to put your product down based on that, but it's frustrating. I think it's priced very high.

4) Based on the trouble Horn had it put a bad taste in my mouth....concern about if I can get the money then what?

5) I understand you are in business to make money. Why else would you?

[mrcllusb]

The one thing cutomers i dealt with respected me about what i told them the bottom deal and that is what kept them coming back and refering others.The respected my honesty that if they didn't need to pay x amount of dollars i wouldn't encourage them.For instance.If a one head system will do fine,they why try to sell them a two head?Yeah we can throw in the sales pitch about two heads will definitely make you laser proof,but thetrue question is,do they really need it? If i tell a customer you don't really need this part but if you really want it i'll sell it too you,they sorta respect me more for that.Like a dual head LPP.Lets say a single head is 400.00 why not sell a dual for 650.00? I think you would really sell more duals for that price.

[davekr]

Originally Posted by mrcllusb

The one thing cutomers i dealt with respected me about what i told them the bottom deal and that is what kept them coming back and refering others.The respected my honesty that if they didn't need to pay x amount of dollars i wouldn't encourage them.For instance.If a one head system will do fine,they why try to sell them a two head?Yeah we can throw in the sales pitch about two heads will definitely make you laser proof,but thetrue question is,do they really need it? If i tell a customer you don't really need this part but if you really want it i'll sell it too you,they sorta respect me more for that.Like a dual head LPP.Lets say a single head is 400.00 why not sell a dual for 650.00? I think you would really sell more duals for that price.

Bingo, I would jump on that deal! That is money I could come up with....the problem is I don't think one head will cut it with an LPP.......

[mrcllusb]

The current pricing is based as if there is no real deal for the consumer.Single head 500.00,dual head 850.00.Where are the savings? The claimed savings are by telling you Dave that you can get it for 800.00 When we can clearly see to begin with,that the single head unit is overpriced from the start.I truly think a better deal would be even if the single head unit stayed at 500.00 and to offer a dual head for 700.00.But asking 800.00 is still too much.