[Subie_07]

Originally Posted by TSi+WRX

Ah, then I apologize. I did indeed (mis)read your comment as a comparison. You specifically brought up two items - LI and LaserStar. If I were not to read as a comparison, then what? I hope you can see where we miscommunicated.

So the LaserStar uses epoxy as a sealant between the outer "glare/shield-lens" and the physical body of the unit? That is definitely something I did not know, thank you for educating me on that one.

The problem, however, remains - epoxy still does not solve the weathersealing issue, which was explored in-depth on an RD.net posting (specifying no particular jammer, just an academic discussion by various materials [and other] engineers as well as those with professional/academic experience detailing various "glues," as to what might be best), as it, too, as with everything else, expands and contracts, and still suffers the problem of needing to achieve "perfect" bonding between a metal surface, and one that's plastic (or glass). Both pose as problems.

All the epoxy does is further protects the components internally if you have a weather sealing issue... its not 100% perfect, but if done correctly by the manufacture it can save the life of your jammer for quite some time!

Originally Posted by TSi+WRX

The other question is, then, how automotive components - such as headlights, as just one example - achieve weathertight sealing, for many, many, many years, even though they do use silicone sealant. And even more so in that in many cases, these sealants' bonds can be broken, rejoined - and the cycle repeated many times - without the need for reapplication of the silicone sealant? Such a modification, "headlight clearing," is a very popular one in the Subaru community, and many of us have opened our headlight units two, three, four (myself), and upwards of over half-a-dozen times, without the need to even re-apply sealant, and yet, have maintained weathertight assemblies even after extensive modifications in this area.

Why the problems, then, with these jammer heads?

Thats easy... 1 reason. $$$$$$$$$$
Its easy to save several bucks on manufacturing if you use cheaper quality sealant or just use korean style manufacturing... (meaning extreamly cheap... sometimes built buy hand) When you talking about headlights... thats a in house car manufactured part... they save money buy doing it in house... and they also would have hell to pay if they used cheap sealant ... ( Subaru's are some of the best cars period... so using them as an expample isnt fair... ) But really recalls would be made and that would cost them more money... now on a smaller scale is jammer companies... if the life expectancy is 2 years and you are only warranted for 1 year, thats called job security... and thats just the nature of business...

Originally Posted by TSi+WRX

Alternatively, did you mean epoxy behind the "glare/shield" overlens? If that's the case, then the LPP and AL both serve as evidence that a problem remains - for despite the use of an epoxy fill in an attempt to put the critical electronics behind a weatherproof seal, it was still seen, by fellow hobbyists' pictures on RD.net, that moisture ingress was clearly possible, and resulted in the destruction of such units.

Again, no perfect solutions, yet.

Go back to what I said up top...

Originally Posted by TSi+WRX

Then how come no one in the mass community, either Stateside or in Europe, had any of these early units?

And if the manufacturer changed, isn't that yet another potential area of concern? and again one which The Goons brought up for exploitation during the time of the MazdaForums "Group Buy," when Ivan and the LI Mother Team cited that they were switching manufacture? The question that was posed by The Goons, then, was one of "how can the new manufacture be guaranteed to be of proper quality?" Doesn't this same question then apply, in the same manner, to the LaserStar's change of manufacturer?

Why, again, the double-standard? Why, again, the faulted logic?

I was simply stating that the information you stated was wrong...
And people in Europe had the laser stars early product... but just like most new products had some QC issues... So they changed Manufactures...

....
And let me just say this... You constantly take my words and compare them with things JTW said... on LJTs and say its double standards ... I am not an affiliate of them or Laser Star... So when you say double standards.... thats towards them... I do not represent them or laser star... So again... double standards ... no... I never questioned the manufacture of LI... I do not even know where its manufactured... as long as its not in Taiwan then I wouldn't have any real issues... The problem I have is the use of silicone... over the components... Which I explained my arguments with earlier.

So if you would stop taking my words and comparing them with JTWs and Audi's that would be great thanks...
.....

Originally Posted by TSi+WRX

So how early, exactly, were LaserStar units, regardless of manufacturer, placed on the mass market?

And agian, how do we account for this change-of-manufacture?

And if these "other iterations" of the LaserStar are to be "counted" in terms of the product's measureable lifespan, then should we also not count the fact that even the present version of the LI was readily available to our overseas brothers, many months in advance of their stateside presentation?

And also similarly, how far back should we trace the roots of the LI? how many iterations should we stake, as the terminus for our duration-on-market/lifespan data?

Again ... I just stated your info was wrong.
The Laser Star probably first started selling product... probably about 2 years ago...

Now I am not saying that dependability and durability are based off this number I just stated they have been around a lot longer then you stated. Obviously you would go off the current manufacture and the current hardware they were using... which in that sense the current manufacture has been making the current Laser Star for a little over a year...

Originally Posted by TSi+WRX

I'm not assuming anything else - and I'm not "stretching" your words.

I'm pointing out the obvious holes that exist, which may be due to miscommunication, or, alternatively, details that you've left out (and are then coming back to fill). It may be holes of omission, or, alternatively, holes in the logic of the presentation/argument, such as those which I've asked questions of, above.

I'm not a fan, as you know, of taking words out of context.

I simply respond to what you've said, nothing more.

If I left out information ask me then... do not give an argument for something that has not been said... leave those kinds of attacks for John McCain and Hussein Obama...

That is not fair to me... not that I really care... its just annoying... and I am less likely to respond ... cause sometimes I leave out information on purpose... and somethings I just assume you would know.

I also leave information out of things to protect other peoples reputation... Cause I really do not care about mine... its not like this board has any effect on my real reputation in life...

Originally Posted by TSi+WRX

That's all fine and well - but your not being forthcoming with such critical information simply invites mistrust and, as you've seen above with just our last set of interaction, miscommunication.

How does that serve anyone in the community? And how does that go any length towards restoring anyone's faith in The Goons or LaserStar?

Thats not my problem... they should put themselves in a position to get information like I did... I am not really concerned with the "community" its all distorted and biased... and if someone goes against the God of all test on personal experience he or she is wrong... I talk about the laser star and so I am considered a "Goon" and I am neutral about LTJs and JTW and Audi... I am part of that group...

The Truth is as a person I am always apart of Minorities...

Politically, I am a Ron Paul supporter!
Religiously, I am apart of a Minority version of Christianity that takes away all the guilt that typical churches put on people...
I drive a Subaru...

I could go on... The problem is people do not check their information ... and I know I do not help when I will not share my information... but hey I found it... why can't everyone else... CAUSE THEY ARE LAZY! and they do not spend time actually putting themselves in a position to have contacts... or check out info for themselves...

I also am not going to tell people information that others are not ready to give out ... thats not how I am.

Originally Posted by TSi+WRX

Ah, here, please allow me to correct as well as educate you. I've been a long-time user of the ZR3, with my own purchase of them dating back to their origin.

Escort's first run of ZR3's were plagued with head weatherseal issues as well. Mostly in terms of its forward two heads. Such issues did not come to-light until after nearly a year's worth of road-service.

Again, without actual time/miles-on-road, it was simply impossible to have foreseen such potential issues. But those lessons were hard-learned, and Escort rectified such concerns.

Similarly and quite sadly (and quite surprisingly to me, actually, as I thought that they'd perfected the issue, having learned, as I cited above, from their previous mistakes), it was again seen with the ZR4 that more than a handful of initial-batch units reported with faulty rear-head sealant issues. Some of the first documented such failures appeared from/were reported from within the core of RD.net enthusiasts, such as djrams.

As for the Blinder, no, it's track-record is not perfect - akin to with Escort - but for the number of fauts that have been reported of both the 0-suffix and the new 5-suffix units, compared to the number of years and miles-on-road that these units have seen, it's hard to say that their quality has been anything less than stellar.

The true test is time-on-road and miles-on-road, and aside from Escort and Blinder, no-one can truly say that they've had quite as good of a run - or as long of a run.

No, their records are not perfect, but it's definitely head-and-shoulders better, compared to what else is still out there, and what has come and gone.

Ah... well its hard to play catch up when you are still in business and you were one of the first jammers out...

............................
Let me ask you a question... Have you actually read the information and blogs on LJTs? Their is a lot of interesting information on LJTs that is not talked about ... and I am not going to tell you but everything important about the Laser Star is on that website... and if you truly have you would be intrigued at some of the comments about the Laser Star... at least I would find them really interesting. Thats all I am saying...