[TSi+WRX]

Subie, please do not misquote me - in the post you referenced above, I never said the words "All the stuff you said...."

The Goons misquoted edweird on the LaserJammerTests opening page, and while my fellow enthusiast's good nature and humor translated to a lack of pursuit of such, I, myself, will not stand for it.

You've been a Forum-style community participant long enough to know how to properly use quotes, and I will not have my words taken out-of-context.

Thank you for understanding this.

Originally Posted by Subie_07

Im not saying trust Audi and JTW... Im saying don't lay your faith in anything unless you have tested it yourself and you yourself have seen down the barrel of a laser gun. This is where I have been burned before.

^ Exactly, I agree.

However, there *is* an issue of trust, here.

Put Audi and The Goons and all that they've done before, up against any member of the GOL individually, or the group as a whole -

The former have trespassed once and again on our collective trust. The latter?

Can you really say what you say, in good faith, given even just the two questions I posed prior? How does one explain what Audi did to Ronin? How does one explain the conflict of CP's data with LJT's, with regard to the K40?

As far as GOL goes, I do not trust them. They all have pretty much taken a bribe in some format or other... I also know that they said no retail people would be there at the test this year... BUT YET ... Ivan was there...

Did they really say that they would have no industry connections at the testing this year? If they did, I cannot recall - please cite, specifically, where they did so. I'm not doing this rhetorically, as I truly cannot remember such a claim/promise.

And how do you, exactly, define a bribe?

Again, you know my stance on this - I don't see a problem if the data is good. "Good science is good science," and others will prove the findings - and to the best of my knowledge, there's been plenty of other hobbyists who've stepped forward to confirm their own findings of the Laser Interceptor - and much of that came well BEFORE the GOL conducted their testing.

Same with PASS, and same with the J15 Blinder 5-series as well as the ZR4.

Thus, if-anything, hypothetically, then, based on the time-line of such testing, isn't the GOL just trying to make their testing data "match up" with that of the other independent hobbyists' and hobbyist groups', so that they don't lose face?

Where would a bribe enter such a scenario?

Yes, conflicts-of-interest should be declared. If compensation is taken for the work performed, and such compensations could be a cause of potential concern with the data, then yes, it should be made known.

I really think that the GOL has taken this to-heart, and have made such issues much more visible.

But the question then returns to LJT and The Goons.

Why does LJT not disclose its ties with LaserStar?

And unbiased because they don't promote anything? Last time I checked, there's still a products-for-sale page. And yes, I realize that doesn't include the LaserStar - I'm glad to see that The Goons at least aren't *that* stupid.

ALSO has anyone seen the videos? Nothing... I also know the whole board over there Pushes the LI like crazy... so forgive me for questioning the results... at least LJTs post up videos with a IR shot and through the scope...

And there's no way a video could be faked, right?

You've asked me to remain skeptical - so I am.

So I ask this:

There's absolutely no way that a video could be faked, correct?

Absolutely no way that an IR shot could be faked, correct?

A video, somehow, is definitive proof, regardless of the source from which it originates?

Should I automatically give more credit to video-evidence, versus a verbal/written report?

TSi your a pretty stand up guy and Im not attacking you or anything like that... at least you see that everything should be taken with a grain of salt ... and everything should be questioned...

Everything should be taken with a grain of salt - everything questioned.

I agree with that.

But on the sliding-scale of trust?

Do I side with people who have done nothing to mar my faith in them - or do I side with someone who's lied to and used his own friends, repeatedly?

Simple answer, no?